Venice
82 posts
msg #88144
- Ignore Venice |
2/11/2010 3:55:18 PM
While I am currently formulating my strategy, some of my order types involve the use of VTSO orders.
I have never used these before, as I have always done limit on the buy & sell.
While I understand these need to have a set range to allow growth while minimizing losses, my concern more so lays on the side of the actual market order.
Is it uncommon to get filled outside of a few cents of where the stop loss was set? It would seem rather redundant to me that not only does the stock half to fall in price to trigger the stop, but then our old market maker friends can decide to give us a really crappy fill on the order.
Maybe mental stop losses are the better route. Just looking for thoughts, opinions, ideas, experience etc etc when using a VTSO order, and if I should just hoist the white flag and adhere to the words spoken 'Ye who enter here abandon all hope'.
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BarTune1
441 posts
msg #88150
- Ignore BarTune1 |
2/11/2010 7:59:38 PM
Mike is the expert on stops ...
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fortyfour
189 posts
msg #88153
- Ignore fortyfour
modified |
2/11/2010 9:40:50 PM
I would use trailing stops.......maybe......
That is if I could have a damn trade go in my direction....
Therefore, I must spend all my time on all those other things....
Trailing stops are a luxury.....
PS:
The one or two times I tried sell limits it didnt go well....just sell.
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miketranz
961 posts
msg #88158
- Ignore miketranz
modified |
2/11/2010 10:24:41 PM
VTSO "virtual trade stop order" is a trailing stop order,routed through Zecco,and is not sanctioned by any exchange.It basically adjusts through their own platform,trailing stop loss orders.Any good broker,Fidelity for one,has what they call oco orders,"one cancels other",and oto,"one triggers other",which allow you to bracket in a trade.I'm not 100% sure if they have trailing stops that automatically adjust with the trade.The Fidelity platform gives you the option of contingency & multi contingency order entry and stop order placement.You're basically on automated trading.For one thing,once you set the orders,the program takes over.It takes the emotion out of the picture,which for most people is a good thing,in a way that it will protect downside losses.As far as adjusted trailing stops,you can always adjust them manually which gives you the freedom and flexibility in the trade.I myself never use them simply because of the trading methods I use.However,I would always recommend placing stop orders on each and every trade,and then honoring them.Also,getting a good fill depends on a number of things.1)Who your broker is.2)How volatile is the stock your trading.3)How tight is the bid/ask spread.4)How much volume is the stock trading.5)How much volume is coming in at the time your stop order is hit.Hope that helps.All the best,Mike.....
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Venice
82 posts
msg #88201
- Ignore Venice |
2/12/2010 12:31:02 PM
Today is a great example of why I hate stops...
The nice little morning crash stopped out BTN at my -4% stop loss. Unfortunately it takes anywhere from 1 day to 2 weeks for my swings to mature -- and these crashes really don't help out lol. Most of the stocks I pick are have just moved up and out of heavy consolidation... and more often then not, have gapped up the day I enter. Looking for trend reversal though.
BTN is now up +5% which I would have sold. My strategy focuses on selling at -4% and +5% if the stock looks like it can make it, otherwise scalp at 2% (still sell at -4%) if it isn't moving hard. I'll try and ride an up movement out as long as possible until I see weakness in the momentum though.
The afternoon rambles of me....
... Cest la Vie!
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duke56468
683 posts
msg #88225
- Ignore duke56468 |
2/12/2010 4:04:30 PM
@miketranz...I have used Fidelity for years with limit buy, sell and stop orders but just recently tried to use the conditional orders, but not sure if it is possible to set up a buy limit order, a stop loss, and a profit stop all in one order. Have you done this?
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miketranz
961 posts
msg #88228
- Ignore miketranz |
2/12/2010 5:00:52 PM
Duke,I just found out that Fidelity has a trailing stop option which ratchets up automatically with the parameters you set in.However,they do not have a three option buy/stop/sell contingency.The way the bracket works is you pull the trigger to buy in either at market,limit,or on stop buy.Then you enter in a oco order,which is two orders that cancel each other out as soon as one is hit.A perfect example would be you buy a stock at $10,then you would set up a stop loss and a sell order (oco)and walk away.I've never used multi contingency orders,simply because I'm at the screen while a trades on.However,in the future I do plan on using them.I think they would be more useful for swing trades or longer term to keep you out of trouble.Also,it's great if you have discipline issues,there's no thinking or emotion involved.Once you're locked in,the program takes over.Hope that helps,Mike.......
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duke56468
683 posts
msg #88232
- Ignore duke56468 |
2/12/2010 5:47:04 PM
Thanks Mike ... it does help. I should be able to set up the OCO order with a trailing stop also since that is my favorite way to close out a position.
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